Maybe these are two genres. Maybe they’re 50. But let’s lump ’em together.
I am curious about two things from Arnab’s recent posts:
–Name 2, 3 good action films that people here won’t know. Then try to say why.
[I was glad to see Michael clarify why “Wolf” wasn’t good, since I’d forgotten. (And I’d note: Arnab, I did see it in the theaters. It was good to watch for about ten minutes, then…. see what Michael said. And THAT said, watch the thing again and come back and tell us why we’re wrong.)]
–I can think of any number of films that, like “Funny Games,” ostensibly show how the audience’s pleasures in violence should be challenged. I can’t think of one that works, that doesn’t arouse the wrong passions, that doesn’t thrill. Are there any successful anti-violence films? (I recall, vaguely, that Truffaut said you can’t make an anti-war film; the medium sensationalizes, is about arousing sensations in the viewer…)
So, my own answer to the first q:
“Nowhere to Hide”–Korean cop movie. Not-great plot, some amazing camerawork/editing, and some ridiculously fine visual tricks (in composition, particularly).
“Bad Day at Black Rock”–maybe less action than suspense. But screw it: Spencer Tracy takes a train into a desert town hundreds of miles from credibility, and spends the whole day trying not to fight with a crew of baddies including Robert Ryan and Lee Marvin. (It’s like the Bizarro version of “High Noon.”)
I can’t say “Hardboiled,” ’cause you all probably saw it. But it needs to be on a list, somewhere.
“The Mission”–Johnny To’s version, not Roland Joffe’s. 5 members of a triad hired to protect a crime boss.
All of these are great for two reasons: a sense of composition which can make Kubrick seem casual; the best action films are also the most precisely choreographed and photographic. And then the shots need to be sutured together with an eye toward narrative more than or as much as sensation. (Both of these also can show, in the converse, why action films suck: see all Michael Bay.)
Action films: Kentucky vs. Cincinnati, West Virginia vs. Wake Forest!!!! March Madness, BABY!
has everyone seen tsui hark’s “time and tide”? this is one of the answers to the question, “what is globalization”? and there are at least two extended set pieces that are just jaw-dropping. i don’t know if the bombay movie “company” qualifies as “action” but there certainly is a lot of violence in it–mike, did you check it out yet? actually there is at least one amazing action scene towards the end. also check out mani ratnam’s “yuva”. both on netflix, and both very accessible to non-indian audiences.
but i think you cineastes are too unforgiving in your evaluation of action movies. there is a certain pleasure to be had in overheated, excessive, incoherent cinema (then again i was raised on bollywood). what is unattractive to me about late hollywood takes on this is that it they’re almost always moralizing. as long as you don’t try to convince me that your movie about blowing up asteroids or pearl harbor isn’t about personal growth i will forgive you almost everything. michael bay and company almost always fail this test (though i did enjoy the cynical “con air”). strangely i don’t remember “brotherhood of the wolf” taking itself very seriously–it played mostly like cartoon-camp to me. not only will i watch it again but to revenge myself on you lot i’ll even write a tedious academic paper on it!
and i think even michael has to admit that john woo can also be a bit much. not just in his crap hollywood phase but even in something like the venerated “hardboiled”–yes, yes, we get that they’re doubles and that it is all very tragic what happens to tony leung, now get on with the double-fisted gunplay already!
I saw “Time and Tide”. I even recommended it to friends, who promptly watched it and now never trust anything I say. Tsui Hark is a great example of terribly incoherent fun. But the incoherence is in terms of story, not in terms of technique. You always know what you’re being shown, and how it relates to the previous shot. I can even put up with moralizing if the film’s formal technique has some oomph. (For a good example, “Training Day”–preachy, and dull ending, but visually a stunner, all the way.)
There’s something about Woo’s histrionics that don’t bother me; maybe it’s how they’re always coupled with two-fisted flying shootouts. I even adore “Face/Off.” (That said, “Paycheck”…)
I have “Company” on my Tolstoyan queue; I’ll bump it up.
Action films bore me. There’s nothing less exciting than watching an “action” film. At some point several years ago I stopped going to see these films, though at the time I didn’t realize it was ‘action’ films I was boycotting. I thought it was just ‘movies I know are going to be very bad and unenjoyable.’ I later realized these were action films.
I will say though that I loved Sky Captain & The World of Tomorrow – and it was full of action. I’d have loved it even better if the all the lines were spoken in a foreign language, so I didn’t know how dumb it was. The first Matrix film, The Road Warrior, Dusk Till Dawn, any horror/action hybrid a la Sam Raimi… I’ll definitely go see Sin City, b/c, like Sky Captain, it’s trying to do somthing WAY beyond action, and it’ll probably be worth my 2 hours and $8, but a worthwhile action film is a rare find; and 90% of them aren’t even worth watching. By the way, I’m a big fan of violence in films. so it’s not like I hate the genre b/c of its conventions; I hate the films because they are so awful.
Sky Captain . . . did we watch the same movie? Action films: Old Boy, The Incredibles and the Kill Bill flicks are the last action films that did anything for me. The Incredibles may very well be a masterpiece of the genre.
I’m responding to Mike’s question posted elsewhere: recommend little known action films worth seeing:
The Outside Man: a thriller set in Los Angeles (great location shooting and a real sense of the atmosphere of 1970s LA) directed by a Frenchman (Jacques Deray; 1972). The film is of the gritty realist crime drama genre so popular in the 1970s (french connection; marathon man; etc–all of them seem to feature roy scheider, as does this one) but it’s notable for its culture-shock view of the US, attention to detail and the kind of deadpan existential dread/humor of something like Point Blank. LA looks even worse than it does today.
The Driver (walter hill 1978): Jean Pierre Melville borrowed from american gangster films to make his great french crime movies; Walter Hill borrows from Melville to make this minimalist thriller. (yes, I am aware that I sound like a bad video back cover blurb).a legendary getaway driver is dogged by an obsessive cop. Ryan O’Neal is somewhat miscast as the driver but since he doesn’t say much, it’s not too bad (still he has such a baby face you can’t believe anyone hiring him could resist the impules to pinch him and say “you’re so cute. yes you are!”) and bruce dern is great as the cop (at his itchy twitchy best). I’m a real sucker for the Zen crime movie.
Charley Varrick (don siegel 1973): walter matthau as an amoral prick–low key but compelling. siegel is a meticulous director, precise without being overbearing.
Death Hunt (Peter Hunt 1981). I saw this by accident one afternoon. how can you resist it? Lee Marvin as a mountie pursuing rugged mountain man charles bronson! charlie just wants to be left alone in the woods; he is forced to kill trespassers; lee is put on his trail but identifies so closely with his prey, etc. dueling tough guys and craggy faces. one of the lesser known last gasps of the western.
I agree with Mike regarding hard-boiled but my favorite woo is bullet in the head where the excessive violence is perfectly paired to the political/personal melodrama of the story. I also love Face/Off–I think at his best Woo manages to achieve real style through excess–so that the action is not gratuitous, because even at its extreme, it works seamlessly with the equally excessive elements of the melodramatic story. the style doesn’t feel like just empty technique as it does in luc besson (our favorite whipping boy right now). or something like that …maybe it’s just cool?
I was gonna mention “Charley Varrick”–damn good movie. I have never even heard of the Deray film, so I’ll look for it. And “Point Blank†is one of those I long to see on dvd, as I recall first seeing it in some crappy pan and scan version on cable…and being enthralled. Lee fucking Marvin.
Speaking of “Point Blank,†another good knockoff: Soderbergh’s “The Limey†steals with style from PB, and has a great small role for Barry Newman. Which allows me to recommend a film I saw when I was…oh, maybe 11?–and thought was the best damn thing ever made: “Vanishing Point.†With Newman and Cleavon Little. Another seventies genre, when Roy Scheider was on vacation: the gritty Zen driving ’til you die movie. (And I’d even let Ron Howard into the discussion, for “Eat My Dust.”)
Roy fucking Scheider. Why did so many great ’seventies actors fall away into disuse? Elliot Gould is still astonishing, if given half a role. Barry Newman–ah, who knows? Did he make a movie after 1976? Katherine Ross seemed unworldly, and now is. (I think she was in “Donnie Darko,†but … ?) I gotta run.
merged the two action/violence discussions–too confusing for me.
carry on!
Last I saw of Roy Scheider he was a russian gangster on the TV show Third Watch. also a part in the dreadful Punisher movie. checked on IMDB and his resume is rather questionable after Romeo is Bleeding.
Point Blank is a great movie..and again one of the great movies set in Los Angeles. Lee Marvin is terrific…and Carroll O’Connor pre-Archie Bunker has a great part.
Strangely enough, Mike, I had the same experience with Vanishing Point–it made a big impression on me when I saw it on a double bill with Dirty Larry and Crazy Mary (first time I saw so many topless scenes in the movies too, I think–I always had a thing about Susan George after that). I never knew quite what the hell was going on between Newman and Cleavon Little (what was his name, “The Preacher” or something–I have a video copy but I’m afraid to watch it and be disappointed) but the odd pace and feel of the movie stayed with me. Zen drive til you die indeed–he drives straight into a couple of bulldozers with a big smile on his face, no? I believe Barry Newman went on to be Petrocelli (in that spate of ethnic sounding detective shows on TV-Baretta, Kojak, etc.)and then on to obscurity.
Along the lines of Vanishing Point, I recommend Two Lane Blacktop.
get this: we used to watch “petrocelli” on t.v in…baghdad. this was in the late 70s. all i remember is that in his spare time petrocelli was always building a wall or something in his backyard with brick and mortar. i was very disappointed to find, when i came to the u.s., that this was not part of the normal american lifestyle.
“two lane blacktop” is good, but more strange than great. you know what’s not a great action movie? “a man apart” that’s what’s not. ah vin diesel. (mike, your favorite, timothy olyphant is in that too.)
Shockingly I discovered at Borders today a 1997 TV remake of Vanishing Point with Viggo Mortensen as Kowalski (the driver) and Jason Priestley (!!) in the Cleavon Little role as the DJ (“the voice”). according to the plot summary at imdb he is driving home to his pregnant wife, a far cry from kowalski’s original purpose. I think also at the end he merely sideswipes a Subaru rather than driving head on into a roadblock.
I also discovered the Cuban writer G. Cabrera Infante wrote the original screenplay under the name Guillermo Cain. perhaps now you can read the movie as an allegory of US-Cuban relations, eh? I figure the naked chick on the motorcyle stands for the allure of consumer goods…
I finally (re)watched The Driver, which I only really ever saw on tv at some point in the ’80s, so–it was mostly new. And as really good as he suggested, a tightly-directed little crime film. Nothing astonishingly innovative but all really good; the precision of editing and framing during the many driving sequences is really effective. But, as Michael noted, Dern really steals the show. Chris, you in particular would really dig this. Really rilly.
I’d suggest it on a double bill with The Outside Man
I watched ‘The Driver’ along with ‘Point Blank’ last year after reading earlier posts to this thread. It was a little gem of a movie. Noe I’ll add ‘The Outside Man’ to my Netflix list.
No I won’t. Not on Netflix. I’ll find it somewhere else.